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TED Talks Daily

Beyond the Talk: Deja Foxx on finding alternative online spaces

with Deja Fox

Published October 6, 2025
View Show Notes

About This Episode

Host Elise Hu interviews activist and digital strategist Deja Fox about how teen girls and young women are using social media and alternative online platforms to build power and community. Fox reflects on her viral confrontation with a senator over birth control access, her work on Kamala Harris's 2024 campaign, and her decision to run for Congress. They also discuss the gendered harms of current tech architecture, including AI-enabled deepfakes and digital violence, and what safer, more inclusive women-led online spaces could look like.

Topics Covered

Social media and online platforms Feminism Women's health advocacy Online safety Deepfakes Content creation U.S. politics and elections Personal narrative Identity

Disclaimer: We provide independent summaries of podcasts and are not affiliated with or endorsed in any way by any podcast or creator. All podcast names and content are the property of their respective owners. The views and opinions expressed within the podcasts belong solely to the original hosts and guests and do not reflect the views or positions of Summapod.

Quick Takeaways

  • Deja Fox argues that teen girls often hold innovative solutions to social and political problems, yet their contributions are routinely dismissed or flattened, especially online.
  • She critiques mainstream social platforms as "boy-built" architectures that commodify women's bodies, enable digital gender-based violence, and were never designed to democratize storytelling.
  • Fox highlights emerging alternative platforms like DM, Sunroom, and Archive of Our Own as examples of women-centered, community-governed digital spaces that redistribute power and safety.
  • Her own trajectory-from homeless teen challenging a senator over birth control, to presidential campaign strategist, to congressional candidate-shows how digital storytelling can translate into real-world political power.
  • She warns that AI-driven deepfakes, largely targeting women with non-consensual pornographic content, will shape who feels safe running for office and participating in public life.
  • Fox urges young people to see themselves as experts in their own experience and to use whatever skills they have-storytelling, art, coding, organizing-to influence their communities.
  • She emphasizes the need for more tech-literate, digitally native leaders in office before meaningful and effective tech regulation can be created.
  • For Fox, genuine innovation and good ideas are those that endure over time and can be clearly distilled and shared, such as through formats like TED Talks.

Podcast Notes

Introduction and context

Host introduction of show and guest

Elise Hu introduces TED Talks Daily and frames the show as bringing new ideas and conversations to spark curiosity[2:33]
Background on Deja Fox as a young activist and public figure[2:50]
• Hu notes that Deja Fox is 25 years old but already has about a decade of experience as a public figure and activist, largely thanks to social media
• Fox built a strong following online by sharing her youth activism, which translated into a budding political career
Fox's work on Kamala Harris's 2024 campaign[3:06]
• Hu says Fox became one of history's youngest presidential campaign strategists as a digital strategist during Kamala Harris's 2024 campaign
Framing of the conversation topic[3:26]
• Hu explains that Fox is challenging listeners to reimagine what the internet looks like and to make social media more inclusive for everyone, especially girls and women
• They sat down at the TED 2025 conference to unpack how online lives have moved offline and what that means
Context about Fox's congressional run[3:32]
• Hu notes the conversation was recorded in April 2025 while Fox was running in the Democratic primary for Arizona's 7th congressional district, and mentions that the conversation references her run

Preparing and shaping the TED Talk

Fox's relationship to TED and choosing her topic

Early exposure to TED Talks in public school[4:02]
• Fox says her introduction to TED Talks came through her public school education, where teachers would play them in class
Deciding what to talk about on the TED stage[4:02]
• Fox hadn't previously thought about what she would say in a TED Talk, so when the opportunity arose she sat with what she knew best
• She concluded that teen girls hold some of the solutions to major societal problems
• She reflects that her friends have built new strategies to protect themselves and her
• Fox notes that she has built political power online that has translated into real-world impacts
Leaning on lived experience rather than formal credentials[4:55]
• As she wrote her talk, Fox had to remind herself she didn't need a PhD like some other TED speakers
• She decided instead to lean into her own experience as a source of authority

Teen girls, cultural dismissal, and Fox's viral origin

Why teen girls are written off

Cultural contempt for teen girls' interests[4:56]
• Fox asserts that people hate everything teenage girls like
Academic interest in selfies and girl culture[5:12]
• Fox mentions her final college essay was titled around the question of why we don't call selfies "self-portraits"
• She says she has been interested in these questions both academically and in practice

Story of her first viral moment confronting a senator

Confrontation over birth control funding[5:26]
• Fox describes her first viral moment as going toe-to-toe with her Republican senator who voted to take away her access to birth control funding
• She asked why he, as a middle-aged white man, was making decisions about her body after dodging her and other activists who tried to talk to him outside his office
Exchange about the American Dream[5:52]
• Fox says the senator claimed to support policies that support the American Dream
• She replied by asking why he would deny her the American Dream when birth control was helping her succeed and pursue higher education
Impact of going viral as a teen[5:56]
• Fox recounts that the video of the exchange went viral overnight and millions of people saw it
• Her life shifted from private to public, and she experienced what it meant to come of age in the public eye
• She notes she was 16 at the time and turned 17 a few days later; she is 25 at the time of the conversation
Being repeatedly counted out and flattened[6:14]
• Fox says she has been counted out more times than she can count
• She mentions that in her recent congressional run announcement, headlines framed her as "Influencer Runs for Congress" despite her decade of activism and campaign work
• She notes she was one of the youngest presidential staffers in history and a digital strategist for Kamala Harris
• She points out she is no longer a teen girl, yet her accomplishments are still flattened and diminished

Structural problems with mainstream social platforms

Cultural and structural dimensions of online spaces

Platforms as difficult or unsafe for women and girls[7:03]
• Hu notes that beyond culture, there are structural aspects of online platforms that can make them difficult or unsafe spaces for women and girls
• She frames Fox's TED Talk as advocating for alternate online spaces built by and for young women

Digital architecture and its offline consequences

Online world shaping offline life[7:26]
• Fox says the world we build online translates into the lives we get to live offline, in politics, culture, and economics
Origins of Facebook and its implications[7:46]
• She notes that Facebook was originally designed as a way for men to rate their female classmates
• She argues it is unsurprising that such digital architecture was not built to democratize who gets to be a storyteller
• Fox points out that Mark Zuckerberg did not design Facebook for her to go viral and be on even footing in public discourse with a U.S. senator while she was a teenage girl working at a gas station

Alternative women-centered platforms and digital world-building

Concept of girls and women as world builders online

Many ways to be a world builder[8:26]
• Fox suggests that even for people feeling hopeless or dejected about politics, there are many ways to build a new world
• She emphasizes that girls and women are world builders online by creating alternative digital platforms

Examples of alternative platforms: DM and Sunroom

DM as a response to censorship of women's health information[8:35]
• Fox says that in response to major platforms censoring women's health information, an alternative platform called DM has emerged as a Reddit-like space
• She notes that a quarter of DM's searches are about reproductive rights
• DM is trained on conversations that women are having with each other
Sunroom as a space where girls get paid to exist[8:56]
• Fox describes Sunroom as a platform where girls get paid to exist, offering personalized and monetized content
• She says Sunroom hosts fitness coaches, career coaches, and "hot girls"
• Sunroom grew out of the problem that on visual platforms, women's hotness is commodified by the platform, which profits from it
Redistributing economic power to women creators[10:10]
• Fox argues that companies make money from users' attention and content even when the users do not
• She says Sunroom is revolutionary because it asserts that women whose beauty is monetized by platforms should receive a share of the profits

Content moderation and body diversity

Bias in mainstream platforms' treatment of bodies[10:26]
• Fox notes that Instagram has censored larger bodies while not censoring typical thin bodies
Sunroom's approach to moderation and safety[10:41]
• She explains that Sunroom uses content moderation done through a woman's lens
• The platform has zero tolerance for harassment and hate speech

Digital gender-based violence and AI

Being a woman online as scary and hard[10:51]
• Fox states that being a woman online is scary and hard
New forms of digital violence[10:56]
• She cites new kinds of digital gender-based violence enabled by platforms, including doxing and deepfakes
• She links deepfakes to broader conversations about AI, women's rights, and who gets to occupy the public square

Ownership, governance, and regulation of platforms

Alternative models of ownership and control

Rethinking who runs new platforms[11:26]
• Hu asks who runs alternative spaces and whether they are profit-driven like mega tech companies
Matriarchal, community-owned digital models[11:45]
• Fox says the examples in her talk explore new models of ownership and control
• She speculates that modeling a matriarchal, community-owned digital world could spark a different kind of world offline as well

Archive of Our Own as a governance model

AO3's scale and significance for fangirls[12:07]
• Fox mentions Archive of Our Own (AO3), founded in 2008, as an earlier example of alternative digital world-building
• She says AO3 hosts fan works and supports a user base of 8 million people
• She notes that many girls her age say AO3 is where they first "found the internet" through fan works
Nonprofit, volunteer-run governance structure[12:26]
• Fox explains AO3's structure as nonprofit and non-commercial
• The site is run by an elected board and is completely volunteer-run
• She argues AO3 proves that there is a different way to govern online spaces

Critique of unelected tech leaders and need for regulation

Tech bros as de facto legislators[12:40]
• Fox says it will never stop astounding her that tech "bros" write community guidelines determining whose bodies appear where, how people talk, and what counts as hate speech
• She notes these tech leaders effectively legislate for a billion people while being unelected and unaccountable

Need for digitally literate lawmakers

First step: people in office who understand platforms[13:10]
• Asked about specific tech regulations she supports, Fox says the first need is to get people into office who understand how platforms work
• Hu references watching congressional hearings that reveal a lack of understanding of tech among some elected officials
Fox's experience of digital violence and political impact[13:26]
• Fox shares that she has been a victim of digital violence and has been on the receiving end of a cyber mob
• She links this to who gets to participate in the political process, especially when many young adults get their news on TikTok
• She cites that 39% of U.S. adults under 30 are getting their news on TikTok
• She warns that if people like her are intimidated out of those spaces and platforms lack protections, the political ecosystem will look very different in five years compared to five years ago
Skepticism about current legislative attempts like a TikTok ban[14:10]
• Fox characterizes some legislative attempts, such as a TikTok ban, as misguided
• She says these attempts have not landed with young people and have been poorly received by those they are meant to protect
• She reiterates that companies need new regulation, which will come from people in power who understand the urgency

Diversified platform ecosystem and gendered online experiences

Goal of diversification rather than one-for-one replacement

Not swapping one dominant platform for another[15:26]
• Fox clarifies she is not arguing to simply substitute one platform for another
• She advocates for a diversified platform ecosystem rather than a few companies that have become too big
Right to choose where to build community and get information[15:38]
• Fox argues people deserve choices about where they get information, build community, and participate
• She criticizes having to participate in a "hate-for-profit" business model just to have voices heard or connect with friends and family
• She wants an ecosystem with more choices and more women builders

Are we already in a gendered, balkanized internet?

Existing algorithmic gender splits[16:15]
• Hu raises a concern about creating a "girl internet" and a "boy internet" and further echo chambers
• Fox responds that we are already effectively in that reality
• She notes that when signing up for platforms, users typically provide birthday, gender, and age, making gender a primary factor in what content is fed to them from the start
• She emphasizes that even on the same platforms, people see vastly different information
Safe spaces for girls versus "boy-built" architecture[16:44]
• Fox says building new architecture should give girls and women safe spaces online to build community that can translate into real-life change
• She characterizes major platforms as the "boy internet"-boy-built and boy-focused architecture in which everyone is forced to live
• She clarifies she is not calling for separate internets by gender but pointing out that algorithms already track genders differently
• She believes girls deserve their safe space and that modeling different ways of being online can benefit people of every gender
• She concludes that no one should be forced into any one digital world, but users should have choices

Fox's journey: from local activism to presidential campaigns and congressional run

Connecting past activism and social media work to electoral politics

Origin in confronting inadequate sex education[20:27]
• Fox says she started a decade ago; despite being 25 now, she has been doing activism for ten years
• She moved out of her mom's house due to her mom's substance abuse issues and moved in with her boyfriend and his family
• She describes sitting in a sex education class taught by the baseball coach and realizing no one at home would fill in the gaps of a curriculum last updated in the 1980s
• She links this to broader information ecosystem problems, noting that while one can Google, finding good sex education information is hard and often leads to misinformation or porn
Winning change at the school board level[20:40]
• In response, Fox began getting active by attending school board meetings and telling her story
• She encouraged her friends to join her and share their stories too
• They succeeded in winning an update of the sex education curriculum in Southern Arizona's largest school district
Realizing the power of her story[20:58]
• Fox recalls that being a teenage girl in high school, the last thing she wanted everyone to know was that she was homeless
• When she saw how sharing something scary and vulnerable could create change, she says she never looked back
• She began attending town hall meetings and confronting senators

From local activism to national campaigns via social media

Getting to college and into the Kamala Harris campaign[21:26]
• Fox says she became the first in her family to go to college
• She explains that an Instagram DM is how she got her job on the Kamala Harris campaign in 2019
• She says the campaign was the most diverse in the field, and she often was in meetings with other women of color who saw her potential
New digital spaces creating opportunities for young people[21:48]
• Fox notes that new and emerging digital spaces created opportunities because nobody has a PhD in TikTok
• She says young people at the intersection of social justice and social media can take leadership in workplaces, politics, campaigns, and Congress
• She argues young people like her know how to use these platforms better than anyone else because they were raised on them

Decision to run for Congress and the importance of youth representation

Reassessing her role after major political shifts[22:21]
• Fox notes that much has happened since the 2020 presidential run and that the political situation is vastly different
• She describes sitting with the difficult question of whether she could continue to do behind-the-scenes work and front-facing content asking young people to show up if they had nothing to get excited about
• Her answer was no, prompting her decision to run for office herself
Need to keep Gen Z engaged in democracy[22:57]
• Fox says young people deserve someone they feel they can really get behind
• She stresses it is in democracy's best interest, regardless of party, not to lose this generation of voters, participants, activists, campaigners, and elected officials
• She argues young people deserve something to get excited about and someone they can see themselves in
Historical comparison: younger Congress after World War II[23:27]
• Fox describes it as obscene that an entire generation, Gen Z, has only one member in the House representing them
• She notes that after World War II, many elected officials were in their 20s, often war veterans who had returned home
• She points out that in the 1948 Congress, many or most members were likely in their 20s, contrasting that with today

Advice and hope for young, possibly cynical people

Empowering youth as experts in their own experience

You don't need credentials or huge followings to matter[24:22]
• In response to a question about cynical or helpless young people, Fox says she wants them to know they are experts in their own experience
• She emphasizes that this expertise is enough to get involved, whether at school board meetings or family dinners
• She says people who care about you will care about what you care about
• Fox stresses that you don't need tens or hundreds of thousands of followers to make a difference
• She believes that when you tell your story and know it matters, others will feel it too

Varied forms of participation and using your skills

Different expressions of engagement[24:37]
• Fox says making a difference can take many forms
• For her, it has been advocacy at town hall and school board meetings and straight-to-camera content creation
• For others it might be hosting talking circles with friends (which she says can be called a brunch), or using art and creative outlets
• She encourages coders to put their skills to good use, photographers to use their talents, and public speakers to step up as well

Maintaining hope and optimism

Acknowledging difficulty while still fighting[25:07]
• Fox admits she is still working on hope and optimism herself
• She says things feel hard because they are hard
• She wants young people to know she is in their corner and will be a fighter for them

Lightning round: ideas, TED format, perfectionism, AI, regrets, and gratitude

Definition of a good idea or innovation

A good idea has staying power[25:57]
• Fox recalls she used to feel she had to write down ideas immediately or lose them
• She now believes that if it's actually a good idea, you'll remember it
• She summarizes that a good idea sticks and has staying power

Value of distilling big ideas into a TED Talk

Importance of sharing big ideas and possibility[26:10]
• Asked about the merit of TED Talks, Fox says big ideas need to be shared
• She reflects that her first introduction to TED Talks was in public school classrooms
• She says that now more than ever, people need a sense of possibility, and sharing big ideas is what matters

What she added and hopes to shed in 2025

New thing brought into her life: a congressional run[26:28]
• Fox answers that she has brought a run for Congress into her life in 2025
Letting go of perfectionism[26:39]
• Fox notes she started this work at 15 and her life went from private to public, with people watching her come of age
• She recalls a mentor, Cecile Richards, who told her, "Deja, you don't have to be so goddamn perfect"
• Fox says it was hard to hear at 16 when she desperately wanted to be taken seriously and was fighting an uphill battle
• She says she is still fighting that uphill battle, but she refuses to hold the pressure of being perfect

What AI conversations are missing: deepfakes and gendered harm

Deepfakes as a form of digital gender-based violence[28:20]
• Fox says when she thinks about AI, she thinks about deepfakes
• She states that in the 1990s-something percentile of deepfakes are porn, and almost all of those are of women
Implications for women considering public leadership[27:59]
• Fox notes that as one of the first Gen Z women running for Congress, she thinks about the threat level to her personal well-being from AI and deepfakes
• She frames deepfakes as a new type of digital, gender-based violence
• She says this issue will influence who decides to lead and take up space in the public square and who decides it is not worth the risk
• She emphasizes it affects not just the targeted women but every woman who sees such deepfakes and thinks "not me"

Regrets, mistakes, and worldview

On transformative mistakes and regrets[29:00]
• Asked about a regret or transformative mistake, Fox offers what she calls a non-answer
• She says she is a big believer that things are always unfolding as they should
• Because of this belief, she says she doesn't really have many regrets and thinks things are working out the way they're supposed to, even when unclear

A specific gratitude: Tucson's mountains

Mountains as grounding perspective beyond politics and TikTok[29:44]
• Asked for a small, specific gratitude, Fox says it is the mountains in Tucson
• She describes walking out each day to see the mountains and sunset, which remind her the world is bigger than whatever is happening in politics or on TikTok
• Hu notes that the mountains have been around for thousands of years and will continue to be, reinforcing that perspective

Closing and credits

Wrap-up of conversation and production details

Closing identification of guest and context[30:05]
• Hu reiterates that the conversation was with Deja Fox at TED 2025 in April 2025
• She invites listeners to watch Fox's TED Talk on the TED Talks Daily feed and at TED.com
Production credits for the episode[30:18]
• Hu lists the TED Talks Daily production team members and their roles in producing, editing, recording, and supporting the episode

Lessons Learned

Actionable insights and wisdom you can apply to your business, career, and personal life.

1

Your lived experience is a legitimate form of expertise that can drive real change, especially when you are willing to share it vulnerably in the right rooms and forums.

Reflection Questions:

  • • What personal experiences have I downplayed that could actually be powerful sources of insight or authority?
  • • How might sharing one honest, vulnerable story with the right audience shift a conversation or decision I'm part of?
  • • Where this month can I deliberately bring my lived experience into a discussion, meeting, or piece of content instead of staying silent?
2

If the default systems and platforms weren't built for you, you don't have to merely endure them-you can help build or support alternative spaces that reflect your values and protect your community.

Reflection Questions:

  • • Where in my digital or offline life do I feel like I'm operating inside "someone else's architecture" that doesn't serve me?
  • • How could I start supporting or co-creating smaller, values-aligned communities instead of relying only on the biggest platforms?
  • • What is one concrete step I can take this week-joining, funding, contributing, or designing-to strengthen an alternative space I believe in?
3

Representation and proximity to real experience matter for good governance; complex technologies and social issues require decision-makers who actually understand how they work in practice.

Reflection Questions:

  • • In the domains that affect my life most, do the decision-makers genuinely understand the tools and realities on the ground?
  • • How might my workplace, community, or industry change if more digitally literate and directly affected people held leadership roles?
  • • What is one way I can either step into decision-making myself or elevate someone better equipped to make informed choices on tech and policy?
4

Digital violence and harassment don't just harm individual targets; they shape who feels safe to participate publicly and therefore who ends up leading and being heard.

Reflection Questions:

  • • Have I ever held back from speaking, posting, or leading because of fear of online backlash or misrepresentation?
  • • How can I better recognize and challenge digital harassment patterns that might be silently shrinking the pool of voices in my field?
  • • What protections, norms, or support systems could I help implement in my circles to make public participation safer for marginalized people?
5

You don't need massive reach to create impact; consistent, localized actions-like school board testimony, family conversations, or small-group organizing-can ripple outward in powerful ways.

Reflection Questions:

  • • Where am I waiting for a bigger platform or more followers instead of using the influence I already have with people who trust me?
  • • How could a single, well-prepared conversation-with a colleague, family member, or local official-move an issue I care about forward?
  • • What is one small, concrete civic or community action I can commit to in the next two weeks that leverages my existing relationships?
6

Perfectionism is a heavy, often gendered burden in public life; letting go of the need to be flawless can free you to act, experiment, and lead more authentically.

Reflection Questions:

  • • In what situations do I feel the strongest pressure to be "perfect" before I speak up or step forward?
  • • How might my opportunities expand if I treated mistakes and rough edges as part of the process rather than disqualifiers?
  • • What is one area where I can deliberately lower my standard from perfect to "good enough to ship" this week and see what happens?

Episode Summary - Notes by Quinn

Beyond the Talk: Deja Foxx on finding alternative online spaces
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