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TED Talks Daily

(#2) Elise's Top Ten: You don't actually know what your future self wants | Shankar Vedantam

with Shankar Vandantam

Published September 20, 2025
View Show Notes

About This Episode

Host Elise Hu introduces a favorite TED Talk by journalist and podcast host Shankar Vandantam about how poorly we understand our future selves. Through personal anecdotes, a powerful medical case, and the Ship of Theseus thought experiment, Vandantam argues that our identities and preferences change far more than we expect, creating an "illusion of continuity." He closes with three recommendations-stay curious, practice humility, and be brave-to better relate to and care for our future selves.

Topics Covered

Identity Personal Development Perspective shift Narrative psychology Decision making Preferences and values Aging Philosophy of mind Relationships

Disclaimer: We provide independent summaries of podcasts and are not affiliated with or endorsed in any way by any podcast or creator. All podcast names and content are the property of their respective owners. The views and opinions expressed within the podcasts belong solely to the original hosts and guests and do not reflect the views or positions of Summapod.

Quick Takeaways

  • We systematically underestimate how much our values, preferences, and identities will change over time, a bias Shankar Vandantam calls the illusion of continuity.
  • Personal stories-from childhood soccer dreams to an unexpected career as a podcast host-illustrate how unforeseeable life paths and technologies make our futures effectively unknowable.
  • A case of a nurse with ALS who chose a ventilator despite decades of insisting she would not shows how our future selves may want something very different from what our present selves imagine.
  • The Ship of Theseus thought experiment is used to explain how psychological change, not just cellular turnover, means we are continually becoming new people.
  • Promises, criminal sentencing, and lawmaking are fraught because they bind future selves and societies that may no longer share today's beliefs or priorities.
  • Vandantam suggests we intentionally curate who we are becoming by staying curious and broadening our experiences.
  • He warns that our future selves may strongly disagree with our current confident pronouncements, so humility is essential.
  • Recognizing that future selves will have new strengths and capacities, he encourages bravery in taking on challenges we may feel unprepared for today.
  • Elise Hu situates this talk alongside Dan Gilbert's "The Psychology of Your Future Self" as part of her personal top 10 TED Talks playlist.
  • The episode concludes with production credits and a teaser for an upcoming talk by poet Sarah Kay about parenting and the future.

Podcast Notes

Show introduction and playlist framing by Elise Hu

Elise identifies the show and her role

Elise states that listeners are tuned in to TED Talks Daily[2:28]
• She frames the show as one that brings new ideas to spark curiosity every day
Elise introduces herself as the host[2:38]
• She explicitly says, "I'm your host, Elise Hu."

Context for Elise's personal top 10 TED Talks playlist

Elise shares a common listener question about her favorite TED Talks[2:44]
• She notes that even after years of hosting, people still ask her which talks are her favorites
Connection to Dan Gilbert's talk on the psychology of the future self[2:50]
• Elise mentions listeners may have just heard Dan Gilbert's talk, "The Psychology of Your Future Self"
• She says Gilbert's talk pairs well with the upcoming talk in this episode

Introduction of Shankar Vandantam and thematic setup

Elise explains the origin and timing of Shankar's talk[3:03]
• She notes the talk is from 2022 and that she watched it live
• She says she "wants to share it," indicating its personal significance
Elise introduces Shankar Vandantam and his central idea[2:59]
• She describes him as a journalist and podcast host
• She explains that Shankar talks about a fallacy: thinking we can know now who we will be and what we will want in the future
Comparison between Shankar's and Dan Gilbert's talks[3:03]
• Elise says Shankar's talk offers a "gorgeous perspective" on the same questions Dan Gilbert explored
• She summarizes the shared theme as the notion that we think we know what we want, but we may not

Shankar Vandantam's personal stories about change over time

Childhood soccer injury and shifting sports identity

Shankar recalls fracturing his foot at age 12 while playing soccer[3:27]
• He emphasizes that this happened when he was 12 years old
• He chose not to tell his parents that night because he was focused on seeing a soccer movie the next day
He hides the injury to avoid missing the movie[3:34]
• Shankar feared his parents would take him to a doctor instead of the film if they knew about his foot
• He describes wanting to see the movie more than he wanted medical care
Walking to the theater despite pain[3:51]
• His dad suggests they walk to the theater because it is a nice day
• The theater is a mile away, so the walk is nontrivial given his injury
• When his father notices he is limping, Shankar pretends he just has something in his shoe
Emotional impact of the soccer movie and aftermath[3:36]
• Shankar describes the movie as spectacular, featuring some of the greatest Brazilian soccer stars
• He recalls being ecstatic after seeing the film
• Only after the movie does he tell his father about the injured foot, leading to an orthopedic visit
• A doctor puts his foot in a cast for three weeks

How his sports fandom changed over four decades

Shankar notes he no longer considers himself a soccer fan[4:24]
• He explicitly says that four decades later, he doesn't really see himself as a soccer fan anymore
Shift to a different sport[4:27]
• He explains that today his sports fandom is tuned to "another kind of football" (implying American football)
• He imagines his 12-year-old self would find this incomprehensible and view it as a betrayal

Unexpected career trajectory and unknowable futures

From electronics engineer in India to U.S. journalist and podcast host

Shankar describes his life at age 22 in southern India[4:49]
• At that time, he was a newly graduated electronics engineer
• He had no idea that three decades later he would be living in the United States
Current role as host of Hidden Brain[4:58]
• He explains that he is now a journalist and hosts a podcast called Hidden Brain
• He briefly describes Hidden Brain as a show about human behavior and how to apply psychological science to our lives

Why his future was not just unknown but unknowable

Missing technologies at the time of his graduation[4:41]
• He notes that when he graduated, podcasts did not exist
• People did not walk around with smartphones in their pockets at that time
Conclusion about unknowable futures[5:16]
• Because technologies and formats like podcasts and smartphones didn't exist, he argues that his future was not only unknown but fundamentally unknowable from his vantage point then

The COVID-19 pandemic and recognizing change in ourselves

Using the last three years as an example of transformation

Shankar points to the period before and after the pandemic[5:27]
• He references who we "used to be" three years ago before COVID-19
• He says we can see how we have changed since then
Factors driving psychological change during the pandemic[5:39]
• He lists anxiety, isolation, and upheavals in our lives and livelihoods as forces that have changed us
• He notes these forces have changed our outlook and perspectives

The paradox of change and Shankar's concept of the illusion of continuity

Seeing change clearly in hindsight but not in foresight

Backward-looking clarity[5:44]
• Shankar explains that when we look backward, we can clearly see how much we have changed
Forward-looking blindness[5:50]
• He contrasts this with how, looking forward, we tend to imagine we will be the same people in the future
• We might imagine the world changing dramatically-via AI or climate change-but not imagine our own perspectives and preferences changing

Defining the illusion of continuity and why it arises

Shankar names the bias[6:07]
• He calls this tendency to project sameness into the future "the illusion of continuity"
Reason we fall into this illusion[6:12]
• He suggests that when we look backward, the contrast between past and present selves is very clear, highlighting change
• When we look forward, we can picture being a bit older or grayer but not fundamentally different in outlook or perspective
• Because future changes feel amorphous, we underestimate how different we will become

Introducing the ethical stakes: the story of John and Stephanie Rinker

Background of John and Stephanie's relationship and careers

Early marriage and moves[6:20]
• Shankar introduces John and Stephanie Rinker, a couple he covered on Hidden Brain
• They had just eloped and gotten married at Cambridge City Hall in Massachusetts
• John was 22 and Stephanie was 19 at the time of their marriage
• After marriage, they traveled around the country before settling in North Carolina
Their jobs and rural context[7:17]
• John became a high school basketball coach
• Stephanie became a nurse and often made house visits because they lived in a rural part of the state
• Many of Stephanie's patients were very sick, with terminal illnesses and low quality of life

Stephanie's strong early views on end-of-life care

Her emotional reactions after home visits[7:21]
• After visiting very ill patients, Stephanie would come home shaken
Statements about preferring quality over quantity of life[7:43]
• She repeatedly told John that if she ever had a terminal illness, she did not want anything done to prolong her suffering
• Stephanie explicitly said she cared more about quality of life than quantity of life
Dramatic declarations about extreme illness[7:37]
• In more dramatic moments, she told John that if she ever became that sick, he should "just shoot" her
• John would respond lovingly, agreeing and saying, "Okay, Steph"

Stephanie's ALS diagnosis and change in preferences

Onset and diagnosis of ALS

First signs of illness[7:37]
• In her late 50s, Stephanie began to slur her words
Medical evaluation and prognosis[7:50]
• A doctor ran tests and diagnosed her with ALS, also known as Lou Gehrig's disease
• The doctor explained it was fatal and incurable
• He warned that there would come a day when she would no longer be able to breathe on her own

Stephanie's approach to living with illness

Choosing joy within constraints[8:00]
• True to character, Stephanie decided to extract as much joy and pleasure from life as she could
• She spent time with friends and family as her illness progressed
• As she worsened, she and John spent time on a beautiful beach they both loved

The ventilator decision in the hospital

Crisis moment when Stephanie cannot breathe[8:25]
• Eventually, there came a day when she could no longer breathe and was gasping for air
• John rushed her to the hospital
Nurse's question and Stephanie's surprising answer[8:27]
• A nurse asked, "Mrs. Rinker, would you like us to put you on a ventilator?"
• Contrary to 30 years of statements, Stephanie answered, "Yes."
John's shock and follow-up conversation[8:34]
• John was flabbergasted because this contradicted decades of conversations about not prolonging suffering
• He said nothing in the moment but asked her the next morning if that was really what she wanted
• Stephanie confirmed again that yes, going on a ventilator is what she wanted

Ethical tension between advance directives and changing selves

How legal tools might have played out differently

Hypothetical with an advance directive and unconscious patient[9:21]
• Shankar notes that if Stephanie had written an advance directive and arrived unconscious, the nurse might have asked John what she would want
• John would likely have confidently said she did not want a ventilator and preferred comfort care and dying with dignity

Legal resolution vs. ethical problem

Distinguishing legal clarity from moral complexity[9:38]
• Shankar points out that such an advance directive would only solve the legal conundrum
• The ethical problem remains that Stephanie at 39 did not truly understand what Stephanie at 59 with ALS would want
Younger and older selves as quasi-strangers[9:56]
• He argues that to the older Stephanie, her younger self might as well have been a stranger
• That "stranger"-her past self-was effectively making life and death decisions on her behalf

The Ship of Theseus and psychological change

Explaining the Ship of Theseus thought experiment

Story of Theseus's ship in the harbor[10:10]
• Shankar references a famous philosophical thought experiment sometimes called the Ship of Theseus
• Theseus's ship is kept in the harbor as a memorial after his exploits
• Over time, parts of the ship rot and are replaced with new planks until every part is new
Philosophers' central question about identity[10:31]
• Philosophers, starting with Plato, ask whether the completely replaced ship is still the same Ship of Theseus

Biological turnover and psychological plasticity in humans

Humans as living versions of the Ship of Theseus[10:28]
• Shankar says that we are walking examples of the Ship of Theseus because our cells constantly turn over
• He notes that biologically, the people we were 10 years ago are not the people we are today
Importance of organization vs. parts[10:20]
• He concedes that one might argue a ship is not just a collection of planks and a body is not just a collection of cells
• It is the organization of planks or cells that defines the ship or body
• If you preserve organization while swapping parts, you might still have "the same" ship or body

Psychological layers and continuous self-renewal

Non-identical layers of the self[11:26]
• At a psychological level, each new layer that is laid down is not identical to the one before
Role of brain plasticity[11:30]
• He invokes the brain's famous plasticity as the mechanism by which we are constantly becoming new people
• This ongoing psychological change has profound consequences for our lives

Practical challenges: promises, punishment, and laws in light of changing selves

Illusion that all ages of Shankar are the same person

Comparing 12-, 52-, and hypothetical 82-year-old Shankar[11:47]
• He says he has the illusion that 12-year-old Shankar (wanting to be a soccer star), 52-year-old Shankar (a podcast host), and 82-year-old Shankar (living on a beach) are all the same person
• He questions whether this assumption is really true

Promises as commitments made on behalf of future strangers

Marriage vows and future selves[12:24]
• Shankar notes that when we promise to love someone "till death do us part," we are effectively making a promise that a future version of us-a kind of stranger-will have to keep
• Our future selves may not share our current views, perspectives, or hopes

Long-term imprisonment and shifting societal values

Future prisoners and future public may both be different[12:24]
• When we lock people up and "throw away the key," the imprisoned individuals will change over time
• He also emphasizes that we ourselves, as a society, will be different in 30 years, with potentially different needs for retribution or vengeance

Lawmaking and outdated statutes

Good intentions at the time of passing laws[12:44]
• We often pass laws intending to improve our country
Laws that age poorly[12:44]
• Shankar notes that any country that has existed for decades has many laws that once made perfect sense-even seen as enlightened-that now seem antiquated, absurd, or unconscionable

Underlying assumption that we are the endpoint of history

Belief that the future will resemble the present[12:24]
• All of these examples tie back to our tendency to imagine that we represent the end of history
• We assume the future will simply be more of the same rather than fundamentally different

Three strategies for dealing with the illusion of continuity

Framing the "wicked problem" of caring for the future self

Recognizing the risk of future resentment[13:31]
• Shankar describes this as a wicked problem because we spend much of our lives trying to make our future selves happy without knowing if they will share our preferences
• He suggests our future selves may look back with bewilderment or resentment, asking what made us think they would want what we chose for them

Advice 1: Stay curious and curate your future self

Taking an active role in who you become[13:53]
• If you accept that you will be a different person in 30 years, Shankar says you should play an active role in crafting that future person
• He suggests thinking of yourself as the curator or architect of your future self
Practical ways to expand your horizons[14:15]
• He advises spending time with people beyond your usual friends and family
• He encourages pursuing avocations and professional pursuits outside what you regularly do
• Because you will inevitably become someone different, you might as well influence who that person is
• He summarizes the first piece of advice as: stay curious

Advice 2: Practice humility in your convictions

Remembering your future self might disagree with you[14:02]
• As we make pronouncements on social media, in political forums, or at dinner parties, Shankar urges us to remember that our future selves may be among those who disagree
Moderating certainty and adding humility[14:50]
• When we express views with great certitude and confidence, he says we should add a touch of humility

Organizational example: fear of future reversal of reforms

Conversation with a young leader about lasting change[14:57]
• He recalls speaking with a young woman who had just reached a position of authority in her organization
• She had many idealistic ideas about how to change the organization and wanted to know how to make changes that no one could undo
Challenging the belief in final answers[15:21]
• Shankar calls this desire human but rooted in the mistaken belief that our perspective on history is the final word
• He states simply that this belief is wrong

Advice 3: Be brave and trust in future capacities

Acknowledging future frailty but also future strengths[15:11]
• He notes he has given several examples of how our future selves will be weaker and frailer
• He stresses that this is only part of the story; future selves will also have capacities, strengths, and wisdom we do not possess now
Reframing self-doubt about big undertakings[15:59]
• He gives examples of hesitations: thinking "I don't have it in me" to quit a job and start a company, to learn an instrument at 52, or to care for a disabled child
• He suggests we should instead say, "I don't have the capacity to do those things today"
• This reframing leaves open the possibility that we might have the capacity tomorrow
Summarizing the call to courage[15:29]
• He distills lesson three down to: be brave

Closing vision of a grateful future self

Conditions for future gratitude instead of resentment[15:45]
• Shankar claims that if we stay curious, practice humility, and are brave, our future selves will look back kindly
• He imagines a future self 20 or 30 years from now looking back not with resentment or bewilderment but with gratitude
• He concludes with the idea that our future self will say, "Thank you"

Outro: Elise Hu reflects on the talk's place in the playlist

Identifying Shankar and dating the talk

Elise reintroduces Shankar after the talk[17:04]
• She says, "That was Shankar Vandantam speaking at TED 2022"

Position of this talk within her personal top 10

Clarifying that this is part of an archival playlist[17:08]
• Elise explains that this is the second TED Talk from the archives being reposted as part of her first podcast playlist of personal top 10 TED Talks

Teaser for upcoming Sarah Kay talk and production credits

Connecting this episode to future-focused parenting themes

Introduction of Sarah Kay's upcoming talk[17:12]
• Elise notes that next up is a talk that has had a profound impact on her life as a parent
• She identifies the upcoming speaker as the poet Sarah Kay

Information about TED's curation and where to learn more

Directing listeners to TED's curation guidelines[17:29]
• Elise mentions that listeners curious about TED's curation can learn more at TED.com/curationguidelines

Credits for TED Talks Daily production team

Identifying the broader audio network[17:33]
• Elise states that TED Talks Daily is part of the TED Audio Collective
Fact-checking and production roles[17:34]
• She notes that the talk was fact-checked by the TED Research Team
• She lists team members involved in producing and editing the episode: Martha Estefanos, Oliver Friedman, Brian Green, Lucy Little, and Tansika Sangmarnivong
• She credits Lucy Little with mixing the episode
Additional support acknowledgments[17:47]
• Elise mentions additional support from Emma Taubner and Daniela Balarezo
Closing sign-off[17:43]
• Elise closes by saying, "I'm Elise Hu. Thanks for listening."

Lessons Learned

Actionable insights and wisdom you can apply to your business, career, and personal life.

1

Your values, preferences, and identity will likely change far more than you intuitively expect, so treat any long-term commitments or predictions about yourself with caution.

Reflection Questions:

  • • What important decisions am I currently making based on the assumption that I will want the same things 10 or 20 years from now?
  • • How might my perspective on a major life choice I made five or ten years ago illustrate how much I actually change over time?
  • • What is one current belief or preference I can hold a bit more lightly, knowing my future self may see it very differently?
2

Actively curate who you are becoming by exposing yourself to diverse people, pursuits, and experiences, rather than letting your future self be shaped entirely by inertia.

Reflection Questions:

  • • Which kinds of people or activities outside my usual circles could broaden the range of who I might become?
  • • How could deliberately adding one new avocation or learning project this year influence the kind of future self I create?
  • • What specific step can I take this month to architect my future self instead of passively drifting into it?
3

Express your convictions with humility, recognizing that your future self may vehemently disagree with the stances you feel most certain about today.

Reflection Questions:

  • • Where in my life do I tend to speak or act with the most certainty, and how might that look from the perspective of my future self?
  • • How could adding a habit of saying "this is what I think right now" change the tone and impact of my conversations or posts?
  • • What is one strongly held opinion I can practice holding more loosely, allowing room for my views to evolve?
4

When you feel intimidated by big challenges, remember that you are judging them with today's capacities, not tomorrow's; you can grow into abilities you don't yet have.

Reflection Questions:

  • • Which opportunities or responsibilities am I currently avoiding because I don't feel capable enough right now?
  • • How might reframing those challenges as things my future self could handle open up different choices today?
  • • What is one stretch goal I can commit to, trusting that I will develop the skills and resilience needed along the way?
5

Design legal, organizational, and personal commitments with an awareness that both individuals and societies evolve, minimizing the risk of binding the future to outdated assumptions.

Reflection Questions:

  • • Which rules, policies, or agreements in my work or personal life might look antiquated or harsh if revisited 20 years from now?
  • • How could I build in mechanisms for review or revision so that future people are not trapped by my present-day assumptions?
  • • What is one commitment or structure I influence where I can explicitly plan for change and future reconsideration?

Episode Summary - Notes by Logan

(#2) Elise's Top Ten: You don't actually know what your future self wants | Shankar Vedantam
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