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TED Talks Daily

Sunday Pick: How Texas became America's biggest producer of wind energy | Speed & Scale

with Pat Wood

Published October 5, 2025
View Show Notes

About This Episode

Hosts Ryan Pinchasarum and Anjali Grover tell the story of how Texas, long associated with oil and gas, became the largest producer of wind energy in the United States. Through an interview with former Texas Public Utility Commission chair Pat Wood, they trace how public input, bipartisan policymaking, and major transmission investments enabled large-scale wind deployment and cut power-sector emissions by over a quarter, despite growing political polarization around renewables.

Topics Covered

Renewable energy and decarbonization Energy policy and regulation Climate change Natural gas Electricity grid Sustainability Systems thinking U.S. politics and elections Climate finance Infrastructure investment

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Quick Takeaways

  • Texas, a state synonymous with oil and gas, now generates about a quarter of its electricity from wind and is the largest producer of wind energy in the U.S.
  • Deliberative polling of Texans in the 1990s revealed strong public support for both energy efficiency and renewable energy, even across ideological lines.
  • Texas enacted a Renewable Portfolio Standard in 1999 that mandated 2,000 megawatts of new renewables over 10 years, jump-starting its wind industry.
  • A $7 billion transmission build-out to the windiest regions of West Texas (the 'Field of Dreams' strategy) unlocked about 18,000 megawatts of new resources and made renewables highly attractive to developers.
  • Wind and solar in Texas started as expensive technologies but became the two cheapest ways to produce electricity within roughly 25 years.
  • The key political framing in Texas emphasized customer benefits and non-discrimination among technologies rather than a 'clean vs. dirty' ideological battle.
  • Wind energy was initially scapegoated by some politicians after the 2021 winter power failures, even though natural gas plants were the main cause due to freezing equipment.
  • Despite major progress in decarbonizing its grid, Texas's overall CO2 emissions are still rising because of continued growth in oil, gas, and petrochemicals, leaving significant work to be done in transportation and industry.

Podcast Notes

TED Talks Daily introduction and setup of the "Speed and Scale" preview

Elise Hu greets listeners and frames the episode

Elise Hu welcomes TED Talks Daily listeners and notes it is Sunday[1:58]
She explains they will share the first episode of a new TED podcast called "Speed and Scale"[2:09]

Description of the "Speed and Scale" podcast concept

Elise describes "Speed and Scale" as a new climate story focused on big solutions hiding in plain sight[2:17]
Hosts Ryan Pinchasarum and Anjali Grover identify major climate wins unfolding globally[2:19]
They talk with people tackling climate issues quickly, efficiently, and at meaningful scale[2:30]

Preview of the Texas wind energy story

The first episode goes to Texas, Elise Hu's home state in the U.S.[2:35]
The episode shares how oil- and gas-rich Texas became America's biggest wind energy producer[2:44]
Texas is presented as a model for accelerating the clean energy transition[2:50]
The hosts speak with Pat Wood, described as once President George W. Bush's right-hand man[2:53]
They explore what is possible for the planet, consumers, and policy when partisan politics do not stand in the way[3:00]

Opening conversation between hosts and 2021 Texas winter storm context

Hosts recall the 2021 Texas winter storm and blackouts

Ryan asks Anjali if she remembers when Texas had a very bad storm a few years ago[3:24]
Ryan recalls calling friends in Houston in 2021 who had lost power[3:33]
Millions of other people in Texas also lost power during the storm[3:35]
Clips illustrate residents describing blackouts and freezing temperatures in single digits and 20s (Fahrenheit)[3:41]
People were angry and wanted to know why the outages happened and who was at fault[3:59]

Explanation of Texas's power mix and political blame

Texas is powered mostly by natural gas, with additional solar, wind, and nuclear power[4:06]
Texas Republicans, including Governor Abbott, used the event to blame renewables for the blackouts[4:15]
Some wind turbines did go offline and wind energy was portrayed as the villain[4:21]
In reality, natural gas plants that provided most of the electricity were not winterized and their equipment froze[4:34]
Failures at natural gas plants caused major impacts on the grid[4:28]
Ryan summarizes that natural gas "let us down" in this event[4:39]
Republicans introduced many anti-renewable bills in response, but Ryan notes almost none of them passed[4:49]

Wind as big business in Texas

Wind is described as big business in Texas[4:53]
About a quarter of Texas's grid is powered by wind[5:05]
Anjali reacts with surprise at 25% of the grid being powered by wind and asks how that happened[5:05]

Introduction to the "Speed and Scale" show and climate framework

Hosts introduce themselves and the show's mission

Ryan introduces himself and Anjali introduces herself as co-hosts of "Speed and Scale", a podcast from TED[5:18]
They describe the show as focusing on the best strategies to tackle climate change[5:23]
They acknowledge that climate headlines are scary and climate change can feel overwhelming[5:28]
The show aims to cut through fear, confront issues directly, dig into obstacles, and celebrate wins[5:37]
They plan to talk to people in unexpected places while focusing on what can be sped up and scaled up[5:39]

Background of the "Speed and Scale" book and emissions framing

Ryan notes that in 2021 they helped write the book "Speed and Scale" as an action plan for solving the climate crisis[5:47]
They spoke to climate experts and industry leaders to create the plan[5:56]
They wanted listeners to hear that there are still opportunities to draw down emissions[6:03]
Anjali explains that "emissions" refers to greenhouse gases like carbon, methane, and nitrous oxide that trap heat in the atmosphere[6:11]
These gases come from sources like driving cars or growing food and are grouped as "carbon emissions"[6:16]
Emissions are large enough to be measured in gigatons; one gigaton equals about 2.2 trillion pounds[6:28]
They emphasize that reducing gigatons of pollution is the scale needed to make a real dent[6:42]

Focus on electricity and the U.S. power grid

The show has mapped where gigatons of pollution come from and will highlight the most impactful solutions at scale[6:40]
They are starting with electricity because it is the single largest source of emissions worldwide[6:52]
Future episodes will address deforestation, transportation, carbon removal, and other topics[6:56]
Today's story focuses on the U.S. power grid, which generates a quarter of U.S. carbon emissions[7:04]
They highlight Texas as an unexpected focus: the state known for oil and gas is now the biggest U.S. producer of wind energy[7:16]
Ryan repeats that Texas is the biggest producer of wind in the United States and poses the question of how a deep red state became "a shade of green"[7:22]

Introducing Pat Wood and his background in energy

Ryan's search for the Texas wind story lead

Ryan says he wanted to understand Texas's transformation and was introduced to Pat Wood[7:32]
Pat is described as the person in charge of Texas's Public Utility Commission (PUC), which oversees electricity[7:46]
Ryan remarks that Pat was "really cool" and clarifies that he means cool beyond just being a regulator[7:52]
Pat helped write 1990s policy that required Texas to build renewable energy, despite initially not wanting to engage with renewables[8:05]
Pat grew up near the town where oil was discovered and later worked for then-Governor George W. Bush, reinforcing his fossil-fuel background[8:16]

Pat Wood's childhood connection to energy

Pat recounts that his grandfather was head of the Gulf Oil refinery in Port Arthur for his whole life[8:43]
• He remembers being known as Tom Hogan's grandson and riding with his grandmother through the refinery plants
• His grandmother would refer to the refinery smell as "good old bread and butter", meaning money, though as a child he found the smell noxious and sulfurous
Growing up in Port Arthur, he assumed every town had its own refinery[9:13]
• He recalls asking a visiting friend from San Mateo what brand of refinery their town had (Gulf, Texaco, Mobile) and being surprised to hear they had none
Anjali reacts that his relationship with energy is very Texan and endearing[9:37]

From oil roots to wind policy: Bush's directive and Pat's initial reaction

Pat becomes head of the Texas Public Utility Commission

In his 30s, Pat was nominated by Governor George Bush to head the Texas PUC, making him responsible for electricity[9:54]
At the PUC, he first encountered wind energy as a policy issue[9:37]

Governor Bush's instruction: "We like wind"

Pat recalls visiting Bush's office every few weeks for advice[10:08]
• He describes the 1990s office culture of wearing ties and suspenders as a Republican yuppie
As he was leaving one meeting, Bush called out, "Hey, Wood" and told him, "We like wind"[10:34]
• Pat was confused and asked "what?"; Bush repeated himself and told Pat to "go get smart on it"
Pat says he felt honestly depressed by the assignment, associating wind with "Birkenstock and Volvo driving people in California" and not with his world[10:51]

Mandate to make wind an important player on the Texas grid

Pat saw himself as being placed on a quest to make wind energy significant in Texas's power mix[11:00]
Texas already had a 1995 law requiring utilities to consult customers on energy issues, which gave Pat a direction[11:12]

Deliberative polling and Texans' support for renewables

How deliberative polling worked in Texas

Utilities used deliberative polling to consult customers, educating them on pros and cons of energy options and then collecting opinions[11:10]
The process involved a three-day weekend (Friday-Sunday) with about 260 customers[11:31]
• Participants formed a cross-section of Texas by age, diversity, and ideology
Pat participated as a panelist for large and small groups and observed discussions through one-way glass in some rooms[11:49]
• He describes it as fascinating to see Texans at their best and "rawest" talking through real-world issues

Results of the deliberative poll: efficiency and renewables

Of all topics polled, two rose to the top: energy efficiency and renewable energy[12:38]
Customers clearly understood and supported conservation/energy efficiency[12:38]
The bigger surprise to Pat was that customers across Texas uniformly said they loved renewable energy[12:56]
Anjali reacts with amazement and asks for examples from specific customers[12:03]

Story of "smoking Jim" and the demand for clean air

Pat recalls an older man named Jim standing outside smoking during the deliberative poll[12:05]
• Pat asked Jim what he was thinking, and Jim put a finger on Pat's chest, smoke blowing in Pat's eyes, and said they had to "clean up the goddamn air" and get more renewable energy
Pat says Jim's statement captured the sentiment perfectly and calls him "smoking Jim in Beaumont, Texas"[13:40]
Anjali and Ryan enjoy the quote about needing "some more goddamn renewable energy"[13:47]

Why renewables resonated with Texans

Pat reflects that energy is essential to Texans' way of life, and renewables appealed because they are local and abundant[12:57]
• He frames wind as "blowing from God's breath" and solar as "shining off his face", both coming for free
He argues that people across the political spectrum resonate with the idea of harnessing a free, positive, new technology[14:10]
He describes it as about technology and the joy of embracing something new, positive, and free[14:28]

Turning public input into policy: Texas's Renewable Portfolio Standard

Reporting the polling results to Governor Bush

Pat presented the deliberative polling data to Governor Bush[13:08]
Bush read the report, then looked over his half-glasses and said, "Woody, told you" and laughed[13:38]
Bush told Pat that conservation and renewable energy, which voters wanted, needed to be in their energy bill[13:55]
Pat then went out to figure out what to do about conservation and renewables[14:52]

Design and passage of Senate Bill 7 (Renewable Portfolio Standard)

Pat says the solution was simpler than he expected: he took the information and wrote it into an energy bill[14:14]
Senate Bill 7, signed by Governor George W. Bush in 1999, created the Renewable Portfolio Standard Program[15:00]
The law set a goal for Texas to add 2,000 megawatts of renewable energy over the next 10 years[15:06]
Ryan notes the bill passed before similar moves in New York or California[15:28]

Bush's motivations and bipartisan context

Ryan asks what motivated Governor Bush to pursue this, given potential political costs[15:00]
Pat explains that Bush grew up in windy Midland, Texas, and knew wind was a vibrant resource that could be harnessed for electricity[15:59]
Bush was a Republican governor with a split Senate and Democratic House, so many policies-including on education, prisons, tax reform, and energy-were crafted toward the middle[16:42]

Market fairness, rapid growth of renewables, and cost declines

Pat's motivation: non-discrimination and giving new technologies a fair chance

Pat says renewable energy was not a personal passion or virtue project for him[16:08]
He cared because he disliked discrimination and saw renewables as a new industry being elbowed aside by big gas, coal, nuclear, and traditional utilities[15:55]
• He felt Texas should not "pick on new people" but instead invite them to the party and level the playing field so they could compete on merits
He emphasizes it was not about a victory of clean versus traditional energy but about letting a new technology win or lose based on its performance[16:08]
He notes that renewables "did ever win" once they had a fair chance[16:12]

Timeline of the wind, solar, and battery build-out

Pat says the real boom started around 2001-2002, with wind growing quickly in Texas[16:46]
• Wind exploited wide-open opportunities: abundant land, easy interconnection, no need for regulatory permits, and a strong wind resource
Solar's major growth came about a decade later, followed by batteries another decade after that[17:06]
Each technology started expensive but became dramatically cheaper over a short period[17:12]
Pat states that wind and solar are now the two cheapest ways to produce electricity and that this shift happened in roughly 25 years[16:35]

Transmission "Field of Dreams" strategy and economic rationale

Need for transmission to unlock remote wind and solar

Anjali points out the need for transmission to move power from rural windy and sunny areas to where people live[17:51]
Pat calls transmission expansion a very important piece, saying "if we don't expand the transmission, we don't get there"[17:49]

Design of the Competitive Renewable Energy Zone (Field of Dreams) transmission build-out

In 2005, legislator David Swinford called Pat with an idea about transmission[17:58]
• They were building wind facilities in "B-minus" grid locations while "A-plus" wind areas remained trapped without transmission
The plan was to identify those A-plus wind areas and build infrastructure to reach them[18:10]
Pat summarizes the strategy as "if you build it, they will come" and notes they called it "Field of Dreams"[18:32]
From 2007 to 2013, Texas built a $7 billion transmission project connecting about 18,000 megawatts of new resources[18:56]
• He says the entire West Texas grid was effectively beefed up by this investment

Impact and logic of building transmission first

Ryan explains that by building power lines in the windiest places first, Texas incentivized companies to build generation nearby[18:56]
Anjali remarks on how logical and forward-thinking the approach was, noting that such planning is shockingly rare[19:12]
Ryan notes the project cost Texans about $300 each and expresses surprise that there was enough political capital to pass it[19:37]

Political and economic framing under Governor Rick Perry

Pat says Rick Perry, then governor, understood the importance of developing Texas's own resources[19:51]
He explains that lower-cost renewable electricity would repay the $7 billion investment five times over in 10 years[19:37]
• He compares it to putting down a nickel to get a quarter, emphasizing the favorable return
Pat stresses that the policy was non-ideological and not framed as renewables (left) versus polluting fossil fuels (right)[20:04]
It was presented as better for Texas customers' wallets, with the added benefits of cleaner air and technological advancement[19:51]

Pat's self-identity, justice lens, and non-discrimination

Is Pat a climate activist?

Ryan asks if Pat sees himself as a climate activist, given his role in deploying clean energy[20:04]
Pat firmly says he does not consider himself a climate activist and that such a title would not be in his top 20 self-descriptions[20:35]

Pat's formative experiences with desegregation and diversity

When asked what he is, Pat describes himself as a kid who grew up where a lot of injustice happened[20:51]
He grew up in a town that desegregated public schools in 1970[20:58]
His parents were actively involved on the supportive side of desegregation[21:08]
Some townspeople moved to all-white nearby cities so their children would not attend school with minority kids[21:18]
• Pat says his church and parents taught that such avoidance was not what Jesus would do, so his family stayed in Port Arthur
He grew up in a very diverse environment, which he says he loves and which shaped who he is[21:38]

Applying non-discrimination principles to energy regulation

Pat believes society benefits from many different voices and technologies at the table, which makes us strong[21:48]
He jokes he might be a kind of social justice warrior, although he associates that term with figures like AOC[22:24]
He says his regulatory actions with beneficial impacts derived from being determined to implement statutes requiring non-discrimination[22:12]
He ultimately describes himself as a lawyer who tried to do what the law required on non-discrimination[22:22]
He underscores that the virtue of the story is that renewable energy became the cheapest energy, making it a win-win for cost and climate[23:21]
He thanks God for this win-win and says they are taking it "to the mat" and believes the rest of the country can do the same[22:43]

Reflections on stereotypes, partisanship, and Texas's emissions impact

Anjali's reaction to the Texas story

Anjali confesses she did not expect to learn something so surprising from Ryan's story[23:43]
She is stunned this happened in the 1990s, in Texas, under a Republican governor who later became a Republican president[22:46]
She says it shatters stereotypes about where clean energy gets deployed best and would have expected such a story in California[23:21]
She notes that despite working in climate daily, she had never heard this story and wonders why[23:24]

Partisanship, data, and media narratives

Ryan suggests the story is obscure because climate and renewables have become highly partisan, and partisan voices are loudest[23:43]
He argues that data itself can cut through partisan noise[23:45]

Did Texas actually cut grid emissions?

Anjali asks whether Texas succeeded in reducing emissions from the grid, which was Ryan's original research question[23:43]
Ryan says Texas "absolutely" did, with deployment cutting grid emissions by over a quarter[23:43]
He emphasizes Texas was growing economically during that time, making the emissions reduction more notable[24:16]
Anjali calls this the most unexpected part of the story: scaling up wind and reducing fossil fuel use on the grid[24:26]

Continuing challenges: oil, gas, and overall CO2

Anjali raises the question of Texas as an oil and gas state and whether that production is going away[23:42]
Ryan acknowledges Texas still has a lot of oil and gas and is drilling more and building more petrochemical plants[24:46]
He notes that looking at overall CO2 levels, not just the grid, Texas's emissions are going up[24:52]
He says Texas has significant work ahead on electrifying transportation and cleaning up industry[25:07]

Opportunity mindset and replicable playbook

Ryan characterizes the story as one of opportunity and highlights Pat's "build it, they will come" mentality[25:36]
He observes that renewables became politically polarizing later, but by then they were too profitable to disappear[25:28]
He argues the story proves clean energy is both a smart business decision and a smart climate decision[26:23]
Ryan says Texas's playbook was simple: add renewables to the grid and ensure they are connected via transmission, targeting the windiest and sunniest places[25:54]
He believes other states can easily copy this approach[26:01]
Ryan notes he found that 32 states already have standards like the one Texas implemented[26:12]
Anjali comments that leaves just 18 more states to adopt such standards[26:06]

Credits and production details (non-advertising)

Show credits for "Speed and Scale"

"Speed and Scale" is identified as a podcast from TED hosted by Anjali Grover and Ryan Pinchasarum[28:53]
The episode is produced by Sarah Craig from Pushkin Industries with production support from Tali Emlin[29:00]
The show is edited by Van Van Chang and fact-checked by Julia Dickerson, Kate Williams, and Jen Nam[29:05]
Sound design and mixing are by Hansel Shi, and executive producers are Daniela Balarezo and Consanza Gallardo[29:08]
Special thanks are given to Jonathan Mallow and Roxanne Heilab[29:17]

Lessons Learned

Actionable insights and wisdom you can apply to your business, career, and personal life.

1

Framing clean energy as a practical, economic benefit rather than an ideological battle makes it easier to build broad, bipartisan support.

Reflection Questions:

  • • How could you reframe a contentious issue you care about in terms of concrete benefits for people's wallets and daily lives?
  • • Where in your work or community are you defaulting to ideological arguments instead of leading with pragmatic advantages?
  • • What is one current initiative you could re-message this month to emphasize cost savings or reliability rather than values-based polarization?
2

Giving new technologies a fair, non-discriminatory chance to compete can unlock rapid innovation and unexpected winners.

Reflection Questions:

  • • What emerging ideas or technologies in your field might be getting elbowed aside by incumbents or existing habits?
  • • How could you change your decision-making criteria to focus more on performance and evidence rather than legacy preferences?
  • • What is one area where you could deliberately create a more level playing field for new approaches over the next year?
3

Investing in enabling infrastructure ahead of demand ('if you build it, they will come') can catalyze large-scale change and attract follow-on investment.

Reflection Questions:

  • • Where in your projects or organization are you waiting for demand before building the necessary infrastructure or systems?
  • • How might a strategic, upfront investment in a shared platform, tool, or process unlock multiple future opportunities?
  • • What is one "Field of Dreams"-style investment you could propose or plan for in the next 6-12 months?
4

Deep public engagement that informs and then listens, like deliberative polling, can surface surprisingly strong consensus across diverse groups.

Reflection Questions:

  • • In what situations are you making assumptions about what people want instead of actually educating them and then asking?
  • • How could you incorporate more structured, informed feedback from a cross-section of stakeholders into a key decision you face?
  • • What is one upcoming decision where you could pilot a more deliberative, participatory process rather than a top-down choice?
5

Aligning climate and sustainability actions with local identity and lived experience increases their resonance and staying power.

Reflection Questions:

  • • How can you connect your sustainability or change efforts to symbols, stories, or resources that feel authentically local to your audience?
  • • Where are you relying on abstract global narratives instead of grounding your message in people's day-to-day environment and culture?
  • • What is one concrete way you could re-anchor a current initiative in familiar local strengths or experiences this quarter?

Episode Summary - Notes by Phoenix

Sunday Pick: How Texas became America's biggest producer of wind energy | Speed & Scale
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